[P95Carry]

OK it's late - I am pooped and about to crash but - just musing (again!).

What makes a BG most dangerous, other than his gun, or knife even??

Vision!! Agreed.?

So it occurs to me that if it were in the least practical -
(and if such could cycle a semi, if semi is carry piece and the first round being shot (7 1/2 or 8) - then at close range with effectively no choke and so pattern spreads well - a shot to face could make a great start to winning the war?!

OK - many possible problems - indexing in a revo - to be sure first round is the shot - and with semi, will it cycle - and for both - what if longer range shot required.

I know there are folks who have opted in a revo to have snake shot or similar as first round - but I had not really given much thought to the BG's vision until now. Nail that and he is way less of a threat. Still then options for drilling if needed but at relative leisure!!!

Of course with HD, and 870 solves the problem quite nicely anyways!

Right - enough of my rambling - I am about to quit. :smile:

 

[acparmed]

This would be very ugly in court. You can all imagine the attorneys working this one over.

 

[KenpoTex]

I see this going one of two ways:

Judge: "I find for the plaintiff and award $X in damages because you blinded him when you shot him. As a result he'll never be able to find gainful employment...

-or-

Prosecutor: "Mr. Jones, after blinding your attacker with your first shot, he obviously would no longer be a threat. Why did you continue shooting? *cell door clanging*


Personally, if I ever have to drop the hammer on someone, I'm going to be aiming COM until he hits the ground. Taking away the attacker's ability to see is a great strategy...and he can't see if I've put 5 rounds through his chest causing his heart and brain cease functioning.

 

[jdsumner]

IF your attacker's actions warrant 'lethal force' (the use of a firearm), then use lethal force to the fullest of its potention-not rat shot in a handgun. IF his actions warranted less lethal options, dont bring a firearm into the picture at all. If you want to incapacitate him without the use of lethal force, use oc.

Dan

 

[Bud White]

Not a good ideal me thinks for the reasons listed above if your gonna shoot, Shoot and be done with it i done want anything that mihgt works kinda sorta well maybe .

 

[GoodSamaritan]

P95, they thrashed you just as soundly as they did me, when I mentioned it.

A shot to the face, or any open skin with rat/snake shot would definately ruin their day, and would cause most "casual attackers to flee, thinking they were hurt worse than they were. Kind of like the old days when people would load a shotgun shell with rock salt.

As for pro's and con's


Cons, Aside from civil and criminal consequences mentioned above.

Will not stop a doped up, enraged attacker, and may waste that fraction of a second that makes the difference between whether the BG drops 6" away from you, or drops after stabbing you in the throat.

Pro's

Almost certainly non lethal.

Range is limited somewhat reducing the danger of hitting a bystander further away, especially if something is in between. (drywall, vehicle, etc)


This is an interesting topic to say the least. Unfortunately the BG, or family's ambulance chaser would try their best to make use of it. On the flip side, you could always say you had it in there for snakes and forgot about it (not that I condone lying)

 

[QKShooter]

Interesting Thought

I have played around with the Speer plastic capsule handgun shot shells in .45 and in .357mag - I mostly just played around w/ them because I like to goof around with fun toys. I'm a very bad boy. :biggrin:
They are extremely ineffective. There is just not enough shot in there to guarantee a hit to one eye let alone two eyes. They also pattern very low...if you could call the pattern a pattern. From 20' away I don't think those tiny pellets would penetrate a sheet of high quality corrugated cardboard.
Truthfully, I don't even know HOW they are effective on snakes at all. Penetration is very minimal & I could not them to cycle the action in my Colt 45 ~ Maybe one of the .410 gauge derringers would fare better?
Out to 20' ~ you would be much better off using a FOX LABS OC Spray STREAM to do some initial non-lethal "Blinding"...that might work.

 

[armoredman]

Don't do it - that shows you thought you didn't have the right to use deadly physical force, when you employed it. Centor of Mass, shoot to stop. Prison food sucks - I eat it everyday, and you don't want to....

 

[P95Carry]

OK already :smile: I was ''feeling the water''.

Two distinct and contrasting aspects seem tied up in this - first and probably most obvious is indeed the legal side - sued from here to eternity etc.

Other side tho is ''but I chose to try a less than lethal approach''.

Overall tho sure - it ain't gonna wash and anyways - bottom line is defence of self and stopping the threat - efficiently. Fear not - I am still on the ''straight and narrow'', in case you thought I'd lost it! :smile:

 

[Tangle]

Well, I have thought about a camera flash. It does a pretty good job of temporaily blinding, surprising, and disrupting plans without a courtroom aftermath. The flash would work especially well in darkened rooms. Sort of a silent flash-bang.

Further, and I don't know why someone hasn't thought of this but...I do some welding and have an automatic helmet. As soon as the arc strikes, the glass darkens and a second or so after the arc is extingished, it undarkens. So why don't we have tactical goggles that work like that?

I'm not suggesting we wear these things every where we go, but they would probably be great for SWAT entry teams in case the BGs have flash-bangs too. We might even find a use for them for home defense.

 

[P95Carry]

Tangle - yep - flash a good ''distractant'' and I too use an auto-darken welder's mask - also could have its place. Needless to say tho we are unlikely to be carrying such things as routine.

An extension of the flash thing tho does come to mind. Folks carry pepper spray, flashlights - and with miniaturization now I could envisage a small flash unit of similar size.

Thus - instead of us temporarily dazzling opponent with the Surefire - perhaps a discharge of flash light. If this was well focussed then the effect on user would be a mere fraction of that on the BG and so potentially useful.

There are (as always) problems - one is that Krypton discharge tubes need a trigger voltage of IIRC 10kv - and this is usually provided by a small inverter circuit charging a largish capacitor - this take time. To keep capacitor in state of constant charge (cos charge decays over time) and so unit always at ready - would mandate the unit being switched on and so battery life could be rather short.

Ah well - interesting to consider anyways.

 

[Tangle]

Tangle - yep - flash a good ''distractant'' and I too use an auto-darken welder's mask - also could have its place. Needless to say tho we are unlikely to be carrying such things as routine.

An extension of the flash thing tho does come to mind. Folks carry pepper spray, flashlights - and with miniaturization now I could envisage a small flash unit of similar size.

Thus - instead of us temporarily dazzling opponent with the Surefire - perhaps a discharge of flash light. If this was well focussed then the effect on user would be a mere fraction of that on the BG and so potentially useful.

There are (as always) problems - one is that Krypton discharge tubes need a trigger voltage of IIRC 10kv - and this is usually provided by a small inverter circuit charging a largish capacitor - this take time. To keep capacitor in state of constant charge (cos charge decays over time) and so unit always at ready - would mandate the unit being switched on and so battery life could be rather short.

Ah well - interesting to consider anyways.

I was thinking more of home defense. The flash unit would be the flash, followed by a bang as needed. Sort of a homemade flash-bang. The flash unit makes the flash and the gun makes the bang.

 

[BlueLion]

P95 what makes a man or woman most dangerous is the "mind" not vision. The determined will to either kill or survive. This is why we as humans are most dangerous animal created. Thats my 2cents.

 

[Tangle]

P95 what makes a man or woman most dangerous is the "mind" not vision. The determined will to either kill or survive. This is why we as humans are most dangerous animal created. Thats my 2cents.

Well I agree with that, but then again, a blinded one is less dangerous than one that can see you. If nothing else, blindness may buy an instant of time.