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That's a good point, but I am not sure it covers the whole issue. I am thinking of the Skokie shootout where the the cop was a master firearms instructor who said in an interview that he practiced a lot. He hit the perp 16 times with a .45, including two in the head and the guy kept returning fire until he got a third hit in the head. BTW, the perp was found to NOT be under the influence of any drugs.

So the proposition is that you have to get a pure, absolute center of head hit with a caliber that has high penetration, on a moving perp. Anything less might not get it. If someone with that cop's training couldn't do that, what chance do most of the rest of us have no matter how much we train? There has to be another solution.
You have a very good point. And just like the Miami FBI shootout, chaos can and will happen.

But, I suspect the case you refereed to is the exception, and not the norm, so I'll continue to practice the normal double tap and look and see if there are other threats.
 

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I've long believed that the likelihood or necessity of the "one shot stop" is overplayed and over-emphasized in modern advanced shooting classes and on the internet forums. As taught in the classes, the scenario is typically the "hostage shot" with only one shot allowed to stop the threat, definitively and immediately. The Fort Worth church guy, as impressive as he was, seems to emphasize the desirability or even necessity of such a shot.

In the classes I've been a part of, the scenario is always the same. The student has to hit the threat in the CPU with the first shot, no follow-up shots are allowed, and anything less than perfect is deemed a failure. It is emphasized enough that the student is taught that he must not even consider taking the shot unless the results are 100% certain. Even a solid hit anywhere other than in the apricot is deemed a failure. One shot, one shot only.

Such a training philosophy is, in my mind very self-contradictory. Everywhere else, we are encouraged to shoot until the threat is stopped. On this one unique, highly-unlikely scenario, we are conditioned to not even take that first shot unless--

Suppose the Fort Worth defender had not dropped the threat with his first round. Should he have stopped shooting because he failed to achieve that standard of perfection we have been taught to expect, and strive for, or should he have kept on shooting? Would he have kept on shooting?

To me, at least, forget the one-shot stop, regardless of circumstances. Be accurate, and keep shooting until the threat is stopped.
 

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I've long believed that the likelihood or necessity of the "one shot stop" is overplayed and over-emphasized in modern advanced shooting classes and on the internet forums. As taught in the classes, the scenario is typically the "hostage shot" with only one shot allowed to stop the threat, definitively and immediately. The Fort Worth church guy, as impressive as he was, seems to emphasize the desirability or even necessity of such a shot.

In the classes I've been a part of, the scenario is always the same. The student has to hit the threat in the CPU with the first shot, no follow-up shots are allowed, and anything less than perfect is deemed a failure. It is emphasized enough that the student is taught that he must not even consider taking the shot unless the results are 100% certain. Even a solid hit anywhere other than in the apricot is deemed a failure. One shot, one shot only.

Such a training philosophy is, in my mind very self-contradictory. Everywhere else, we are encouraged to shoot until the threat is stopped. On this one unique, highly-unlikely scenario, we are conditioned to not even take that first shot unless--

Suppose the Fort Worth defender had not dropped the threat with his first round. Should he have stopped shooting because he failed to achieve that standard of perfection we have been taught to expect, and strive for, or should he have kept on shooting? Would he have kept on shooting?

To me, at least, forget the one-shot stop, regardless of circumstances. Be accurate, and keep shooting until the threat is stopped.
I have always been taught that you do this. I have added a piece to this logic for my own training and mindset. The most important round you send to target (bad guy) is the first one. That is the one that just may buy you that little extra piece of time and wherewithal to deliver your follow up shots effectively. That first round (hit), regardless or where it hits the BG just might cause hit a moment of grief and confusion, be it in a leg, arm, wrist, shoulder, stomach, or wherever.

This does by no means is to say you deliver that first round then wait to see what the BG does. Of course not, that would be madness. What it does say is that you should train to get your gun into play and fire it very quickly at the target. The faster you can do this, draw, fire, and hit, the better chance you have to deliver those followup shots to end the fray.
 

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I wouldn't mind having my GLOCK 30S in that situation. Oh, and stoked with 230 gr. HST's …. like it always is.
 

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BTW, does anybody know what gun/caliber Wilson used ???
 
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The round was a .357Sig from a Sig 229. Jack Wilson, "The only clear shot I had was his head because I still had people in the pews that were not all the way down … that was my one shot. When I teach people, I teach them not to shoot the head unless that's all you have," Wilson said, explaining that it's easier to hit a person in their body because it's a larger target than the head. "If that's the only shot you've got, then that's the shot you take."https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/churchs-head-of-security-says-he-killed-an-evil-not-a-human-in-taking-down-gunman/2283824/

One reason I like the bowling pin shoots our club ran and popularized in our area was because the target was small and I knew I was hot when the gun came up from the low ready and went off the instant it was horizontal to the target and moved on to the next and next. That is where I learned my double action on a revolver and never took the first shot single action as some liked to. That meant once you were committed to the shot, the trigger was being pressed as the gun was coming on target. Unless of course you had a light short trigger, and you trained that way. Either way, I can see how switching between guns with entirely different triggers could cost you valuable time in a critical moment. Yet, at one time in my life, it seemed like I was able to do that. Now? It might be better to limit the varieties and stick to one or two.
 

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The round was a .357Sig from a Sig 229. Jack Wilson, "The only clear shot I had was his head because I still had people in the pews that were not all the way down … that was my one shot. When I teach people, I teach them not to shoot the head unless that's all you have," Wilson said, explaining that it's easier to hit a person in their body because it's a larger target than the head. "If that's the only shot you've got, then that's the shot you take."https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/churchs-head-of-security-says-he-killed-an-evil-not-a-human-in-taking-down-gunman/2283824/

One reason I like the bowling pin shoots our club ran and popularized in our area was because the target was small and I knew I was hot when the gun came up from the low ready and went off the instant it was horizontal to the target and moved on to the next and next. That is where I learned my double action on a revolver and never took the first shot single action as some liked to. That meant once you were committed to the shot, the trigger was being pressed as the gun was coming on target. Unless of course you had a light short trigger, and you trained that way. Either way, I can see how switching between guns with entirely different triggers could cost you valuable time in a critical moment. Yet, at one time in my life, it seemed like I was able to do that. Now? It might be better to limit the varieties and stick to one or two.
Have you practiced timed drills from the draw? Shooting on the move from the draw?
 

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My 3" SP101 357 magnum stoked with Barnes 125 grain TAC-XPD would be my choice, out of my small arsenal of handguns.

That combination has been real accurate at 15 yards for me, and I have total faith in that particular round for a one stop shot, if I do my part.
 

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Glock 32, Glock 33, Sig 229 in .357 Sig...It is an interesting cartridge. I do a lot of ballistic gel testing and every time I would test the .357 Sig it would literally rock the block...I think of it like getting punched by Mike Tyson..
 

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Have you practiced timed drills from the draw? Shooting on the move from the draw?
I habitually practice drawing from concealment. Even at work before I retired, I would point my small portable drill and engage the trigger as I walked around with it. I've always worked on coming on target quickly. There may be a timer still down the basement from years ago but I haven't worked with one in years. Shooting on the move from the draw has got to be my one big weakness along with moving after a shot. It's been pointed out the few times I had a chance to shoot those projection screen programs. We're told to move but old target shooting habits resist movement. Luckily the outdoor range I like usually allows me to set up multiple targets and when no one else is present, I can work on that.
 

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I can make that shot with any gun I carry. If you cannot on a good day, on a square range place your shots into a playing at the distance you plane to shoot, you are never gonna do it under stress.
The inconvenient truth....
 

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Honestly, I would have a hard time making that shot, no matter the hardware in my hand. Especially if the criminal is in motion. Shooting a paper target successfully isn't a portent of things to come.

Probably my Hi Power or CZ 75B if pressed.

My GLOCK 21 is also very much in the running, big as it is.
 

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I can make that shot with any gun I carry. If you cannot on a good day, on a square range place your shots into a playing at the distance you plane to shoot, you are never gonna do it under stress.
Not just "The inconvenient truth" but also the expensive one to get there and stay there.......
 
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