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Wrong. The Swede stated that their death numbers are more accurate than most countries.
Most other countries are counting most hospital deaths. Sweden keeps track of every citizen(which is scary) and they are counting total virus deaths at home or in hospital.
Sure they have a different mentality than us. But a bit ironic that a socialist government did not mandate a shut down and allowed the citizens to do it voluntarily.
Whereas we here in Freedom's sacred place force our citizens to comply.
I do not want to be Sweden by any means, but it does raise some interesting questions.
My tin foil hat is not protecting me from thinking that this crisis is being used and dragged out for the benefit of the Globalist's and Communists
Sweeden is not a socialist government. They are a representative/parliamentary democracy. Business and property is privately owned. They have socialized programs that have been rolled back when taxes could no longer fund them.
 

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It seems modern American government excels at prolonging a crises. I'm not saying they mean to or not mean to. They're just very good at not being good enough.
 

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The same could be said for, "Why can't we find a happy medium on gun control--or any other protected right?"
 

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50,000 vs the now reported number 22 million unemployed due to the shutdowns. Truly, do the actions being taken warrant the severity of the issue?

This nation has had a steady population of roughly 325 to 330 million people. 50,000 sounds horrible, but is a small fraction of the population. The 21 to 22 million figure I saw reported yesterday, is a huge number and a significant part of the population. My belief is that the cure is worse than the disease.
I have an actuarial likelihood of living another 22-27 years. But due to medical conditions, I have a very high likelihood of dying this year if I get this virus. I am taking every precaution but other people have to do their part or my efforts will be in vain. So how many people, including me personally, are you willing to put at risk because a lot of people have failed to prep themselves against economic misfortune?

As I have said in earlier posts I have been long term unemployed multiple times in my life, but I survived and clawed my way back. Over the last 10 years, I have done what it takes to be nearly bulletproof financially. I am not rich, but i will not be poor no matter what happens. Most people in this country have failed to do that even after the lessons of 2008. I don't take kindly to my life being put at risk because so many people have not prepared for this.

This has been foreseen for years and this will certainly happen again. Next time it may well be worse. And it may be a different set of vulnerable people next time. It may be kids, who knows? And people are having this discussion after only two months. Two months! That is nothing in economic terms. This is nowhere near SHTF standards. We really need to decide what a life is worth, because it will come to that at some point.
 

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I have an actuarial likelihood of living another 22-27 years. But due to medical conditions, I have a very high likelihood of dying this year if I get this virus. I am taking every precaution but other people have to do their part or my efforts will be in vain. So how many people, including me personally, are you willing to put at risk because a lot of people have failed to prep themselves against economic misfortune?

As I have said in earlier posts I have been long term unemployed multiple times in my life, but I survived and clawed my way back. Over the last 10 years, I have done what it takes to be nearly bulletproof financially. I am not rich, but i will not be poor no matter what happens. Most people in this country have failed to do that even after the lessons of 2008. I don't take kindly to my life being put at risk because so many people have not prepared for this.

And this will happen again. Next time it may well be worse. We really need to decide what a life is worth, because it will come to that at some point.
From what I have heard is that the measures they are taking will not make that much difference in whether you will get it or not. Prolonging this could actually make it more likely that you will get it.
 

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The irony of all of this is that hospitals are really hurting financially and most doctors have cancelled their appointments. The two very things that you rely on during a health crisis aren't there, or at such a diminished capacity that they're useless.
That is true. We have a small local hospital that I know quite a few people that work there that will more than likely shut down because of this. If that happens to a lot of them I have to wonder how that will effect the healthcare in the country if we lose a lot of the smaller hospitals. How many lives will be effected or even lost in the future because of this?
 

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From what I have heard is that the measures they are taking will not make that much difference in whether you will get it or not. Prolonging this could actually make it more likely that you will get it.
There are so many "From what I have heards" in this. I know that is what some people choose to believe, people trying to rationalize the argument. Even if it is true, I would like to prolong my life as long as I can, thank you very much.
 

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There are so many "From what I have heards" in this. I know that is what some people choose to believe, people trying to rationalize the argument. Even if it is true, I would like to prolong my life as long as I can, thank you very much.
Then take the precautions that you need to. Everyone should already be doing that every day any ways.

You could just as easily be killed by a drunk/texting driver any day of the week as well. Do you advocate that everyone should be walking around?

The hospitals here won't close. We are a regional hospital hub that gets more resources than the smaller local hospitals. Many of the staff are already dealing with reduced hours. With the word coming down that some layoffs will be coming before the Wisconsin shutdown ends.
 

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Then take the precautions that you need to. Everyone should already be doing that every day any ways.

You could just as easily be killed by a drunk/texting driver any day of the week as well. Do you advocate that everyone should be walking around?

The hospitals here won't close. We are a regional hospital hub that gets more resources than the smaller local hospitals. Many of the staff are already dealing with reduced hours. With the word coming down that some layoffs will be coming before the Wisconsin shutdown ends.
No, I could not just as easily be killed by a drunk/texting driver. I have scarcely left the house. And I can look out for bad drivers. How do you look out for this?

The only thing I advocate is people not suggesting risks to my life without my consent. To me it is analogous to someone suggesting I put my life at risk by not carrying a gun. I have volunteered to risk my life for the public good in the military, but I freely chose to do so.

In my life, losing a job and/or being out of work for two months has happened so many times I can't remember. Death will only happen once and I'd like to put it off for a while, that's all.
 

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Texas has seen 6737 flu deaths as of April 19. To date, we have 571 COVID deaths. So when does this get bad? We shut down schools over COVID that basically doesn’t affect children, but keep it going for the flu that has resulted in 31 deaths this year in children ages 5-17. The entire United States does not have that many covid deaths for that age group. Still waiting to see when COVID gets bad. The numbers are not showing it to be worse than a results of a mild flu season that we have a vaccine for.
 

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"The only thing I advocate is people not suggesting risks to my life without my consent. To me it is analogous to someone suggesting I put my life at risk by not carrying a gun. I have volunteered to risk my life for the public good in the military, but I freely chose to do so." Hear, Hear, @jmf552. Same here.
When I said something similar recently on another thread, my patriotism was called into question and I was told to stay home and let everyone else choose to do their thing. That's fine in theory -- but how about when someone chooses to go back to work, be in public, etc. -- then goes into the grocery store at the same time I have to be there? They infect me. Was that my choice?

"The numbers are not showing it to be worse than a results of a mild flu season that we have a vaccine for. " Havok, that is an absolutely false and incredibly ridiculous statement. If you wish to believe it, go for it. Do you have any medical or scientific data to back that statement up? Just curious.... :scratchchin:
 

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There are so many "From what I have heards" in this. I know that is what some people choose to believe, people trying to rationalize the argument. Even if it is true, I would like to prolong my life as long as I can, thank you very much.
But you seem to be following a lot of what I have heards. Just so you know the what I have heards came from the same people that preached we should shut the economy down. They have admitted it will not probably save lives but only flatten the curve and they did it not to overwhelm hospitals but very few if any hospitals were over whelmed at all.
 

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Texas has seen 6737 flu deaths as of April 19. To date, we have 571 flu deaths. So when does this get bad? We shut down schools over COVID that basically doesn’t affect children, but keep it going for the flu that has resulted in 31 deaths this year in children ages 5-17. The entire United States does not have that many covid deaths for that age group. Still waiting to see when COVID gets bad. The numbers are not showing it to be worse than a results of a mild flu season that we have a vaccine for.
They will tell you that it is because of the draconian measures they have enacted. Some will choose to believe them.
 

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But you seem to be following a lot of what I have heards. Just so you know the what I have heards came from the same people that preached we should shut the economy down. They have admitted it will not probably save lives but only flatten the curve and they did it not to overwhelm hospitals but very few if any hospitals were over whelmed at all.
Well I am happy we are erring on the side of caution. It's my actual life were talking about here. And the economy is not shut down. It is impaired, but my wife and I are going to pick up dinner at a restaurant in a few minutes, which is allowed. We get Amazon deliveries every day. In fact, we have been able to get pretty much everything we need. Somebody is working. When an economy is shut down, you don't get nothin' you don't barter for.
 

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Obviously, some will choose to believe what they want to believe. Scientific/medical/epidemiological evidence, studies, and knowledge be damned, eh?
 

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Well, I’m glad this is settled.
OK everyone, until JMF552 and Wavygravy die we all have to stay home and not work. Hopefully they will not outlast your savings.
 

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Well I am happy we are erring on the side of caution. It's my actual life were talking about here. And the economy is not shut down. It is impaired, but my wife and I are going to pick up dinner at a restaurant in a few minutes, which is allowed. We get Amazon deliveries every day. In fact, we have been able to get pretty much everything we need. Somebody is working. When an economy is shut down, you don't get nothin' you don't barter for.
But they have admitted that the measures will probably not keep you from getting it and only will change the time you get it.
 

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But they have admitted that the measures will probably not keep you from getting it and only will change the time you get it.
Yeah, they keep skipping over the”we have no cure” part.
 

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But they have admitted that the measures will probably not keep you from getting it and only will change the time you get it.
First, who is "they?" And the later I get it the better. However long that is, I will live that much longer and medical science will have more experience treating it. As a martial arts instructor I had who was a Vietnam vet used to say. "Breathe. When you are about to die, every breath is an eternity."
 
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