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Name one police department in America that carries unloaded. Does he go hunting unloaded? Does the military go unloaded? What kind of gun does he own that isnt safe loaded and holstered?

I honestly cant think of one good reason to carry unchambered, let alone unloaded! :ticking:

 

That's one point I argued with him. I can understand not carrying chambered, but never completely unloaded. It would be a one in ten billion chance of a situation arising where a semi-auto could rack a round while holstered. An order of magnitude less likely if you have a thumb safety as well. He still just looked blankly at me and said "You should never carry loaded. Ask your Uncle."

For reference, my uncle is an avid hunter and a retired paramedic/firefighter with 30 years experience. My father didn't respond when I noted that whenever my uncle would take me hunting with him when I was younger, he'd have me carry a fully loaded and chambered shotgun - we only ever unloaded when we got to the truck because it was required by law to do so at that point.

 

"An unloaded gun is an expensive rock" ????

Set up some drills, very carefully.

Him with his gun unloaded, empty mag on hand (really, really be sure no ammo is around). You come at him, see if he can draw, load and aim (at a point away from you) before you can touch him. Sort of a variation on the Teuller drill.

Or just time him on the draw/load/aim drill.

 

Grab a few Airsoft guns and spend some time proving your point.

 

Lots of people, even instructors, misinterpret or misrepresent the NRA's third rule of gun safety, "ALWAYS keep the gun unloaded until ready to use" to mean that the gun should not be loaded until ready to fire.

 

There are only two possible states to be in and those are ready and not ready. Almost ready is still not ready.

Round chambered = round ready to be fired

Round ready to be fired = a state of ready

Round not chambered = round not ready to be fired

Round not ready to be fired = a state of not ready

Chambered and ready to go just seems a whole lot more logical to me than not chambered and not ready to go.

I'm not quite sure why anyone would want to keep their first round in a state of unreadiness.

The states of ready and not ready are polar opposites.

Even though there are two possible states to be in (ready or not ready), you can only be in one state at any given time and only one of those two states can be considered the correct state to be in when imminent danger presents itself.

When imminent danger presents itself, do you want to be ready or not ready? I choose ready.

 

you can't argue it. because he doesn't sound like he is willing to budge.

 

Wait, unloaded ????

[hits delete key a buncha times]

I've got nothing.

 

I never carry loaded. Not when I have this nice pistol-shaped club on my belt, lol.

Seriously - always loaded: 14 rounds in the mag +1 in the pipe & a spare 14 round mag. This is from someone who likes to boast that he only need one shot to finish the job, lol.

 

Limatunes has a youtube video on this. Show him that. Doubt it will change his mind, though.

Sent via mental telepathy

 

Limatunes has a youtube video on this. Show him that. Doubt it will change his mind, though.Sent via mental telepathy

Should You Carry A Round In The Chamber? - YouTube

 

Tell him that he should not be carrying at all if he is going to carry unchambered.

 

Next time he tells you that just say, "Right, Dad". And then change the subject to football.

You've made every reasonable argument and he doesn't sound willing to change. His mind is made up, further debate is useless. The only way his mind will be changed is when he finds himself in a tight spot and thinks, "I sure wish I loaded my gun 3 seconds ago." And let's hope that doesn't happen.

 

Do as you please and let Dad do the same. He is wrong of course but he's managed to stay above ground this long and not likely to change his mind now. He doesn't feel safe carrying a loaded gun and that's it.

 

If you aren't going to carry it loaded, then just don't carry at all. What's the point? In a panic situation, you're going to be more dangerous trying to load the stupid thing than carrying it the way it was designed. Just make sure you have a good quality holster and belt, made for that weapon that covers the trigger.

Tune him in to YouTube with videos of criminals robbing, mugging, stabbing or shooting someone and have him pretend he's there, trying to load a SD weapon. I think he's going to be shocked how much faster it really happens vs. whatever it is he's picturing. And I've yet to see a BG honor a time-out for someone to load up.

In short, 1. They are designed for it, (SAFE) and 2. there is no time to play around when you actually need it.

In court, methinks that he's going to have a tough time when questioned about having enough time to load a weapon from empty but not enough time to get away.

IMO, carrying a firearm unloaded or not chambered is a good way to get dead when confronting someone who wants to kill you.

 

How would one carry a revolver for self defense in an unloaded fashion? I under sticking a mag in a semi auto and racking it, but a revolver, or worse yet a single action revolver?


To answer your question, fathers tend no to learn from sons, so stop trying. Just dont let him try to instruct anyone.

 

Take a defensive course together.

Any instructor worth his salt will be able to explain it.

Sent from my Galaxy S2

 

If someone is threatening your life, or has a knife or gun, you are already way behind the power curve.... let alone then having to load a mag and one in the chamber.
It's time you may and probably are NOT going to have. The bottom liine question in this, DO YOU .... want to bet your life on it that you'll have "time" ??? I don't, and my experience says... keep that sucker loaded and one in the chamber.

Now, to put another spin on this...... sounds like he's been exposed to the "old school" (so am I) , when police and everyone constantly told people to NOT have a loaded gun.... too many ND's, lack of safe handling, and the way some of the guns were made at that time. it was because they were more afraid people would accidentally shoot themselves or a loved one when mishandling a gun , or the lack of safety features in comparison to today's guns.

I know ... I can waste the first 2.5 seconds to pull a mag and load the gun, or I can draw and shoot every round in it in about 2.5 seconds. I'll stick with the later.

 

Ask ur dad whos side is he on ur side or the bad guy? LOL. i carry mine cocked and locked...

 

He is making that up... no way an instructor would say that.

 

Way. I have heard it personally.

 

Your dad would be safer if he kept the rounds OUT of the magazine too, preferably in the original box. The box of ammo would go in one pocket and the gun in the holster. The empty mag should be stored in a third separate location on your body. This keeps the boxed ammo from mixing with the gun and magazine and accidentally chambering itself. When confronted with danger, it is a simple matter of unpacking the ammo and loading the magazine. Then insert mag. Then chamber the round. It is polite to ask the bad guy to wait while this is being done.

 

If you can afford it buy a side of beef or a pig. Why? Simple, hang it up then give your dad a knife that would be somewhat common in an attack. Now give him 3 seconds to as much damage as possible. After he sees for himself how much damage can be done in 3 seconds he may change his mind. After the day is done you can have a BBQ with whats left. Also he needs better instructors. Every instructor I have had said exactly the opposite of his.

 

^^^
This. Combine with the Tueller drill. Might get your point across.
My father has made leaps and bounds learning about firearms and the reasons for carrying them with one in the pipe.
He used to be against it and now he understands the concept.

Next time you're in a situation where you can (safely) handle your firearm... place your loaded cocked pull-the-trigger-and-it-goes-bang pistol on the table (obviously pointed in a safe direction) and ask him if its going to go bang without being touched. (He should say something along the lines of "no") then place it in a proper holster that completely covers the trigger and ask him the same question again. (Once again he should say "no") and then dont say another word about it and go back to doing what you were. Let his mind do the work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk, please excuse typos.

 

Have him call David Medlin, Ochiltree County sherrif in Vega TX. He taught us to carry cocked and locked, safety optional depending on the weapon. He is a certified CHL instructor. Been teaching for 15 years or so.

 

Just agree to disagree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Discuss his desires and expectations for your funeral.

 

Tell him that if he were to take a basic pistol class they would teach him that, "All guns are loaded all the time."

It shouldn't matter if it's "loaded" or "not loaded." It's a gun and it should be treated the same no matter what. And if you treat it with that kind of respect 100% of the time then there will be no need to worry about it.

 

THIS!

But I think you're dealing with "powdered butt" syndrome.

Meaning, no one will be corrected by someone whose butt they powdered as an infant.

Good luck anyway. :smile:

 

Other than having him go through the act of drawing, loading, racking the slide and firing (using snap caps) while timed, there is nothing you can do.

I can understand not carrying chambered, but never completely unloaded.

Really? Are you willing to bet you life that you can draw, rack the slide, aim and fire at someone running at you with a knife, before they reach you and plunge it into your chest? That isn't a bet I'm willing to take.

 

Other than having him go through the act of drawing, loading, racking the slide and firing (using snap caps) while timed, there is nothing you can do.



Really? Are you willing to bet you life that you can draw, rack the slide, aim and fire at someone running at you with a knife, before they reach you and plunge it into your chest? That isn't a bet I'm willing to take.

I didn't say I carry unchambered, I just said I can understand why someone would.