Wow, that's quite a 1st post! Might I respectfully suggest, before dropping considerable coin on a semi-custom EDC, that you speak to an attorney licensed to practice in Michigan? Perhaps even the Michigan AG's office?

Welcome to the forum!

 

Thank you, I'm Glad I found the forum seems to fit me pretty good. I had already bought the knife, been wanting it for awhile and after my last knife broke I decided it was time to finally get it. Hasn't came in the mail yet, but as I was waiting for my package my brain started thinking laws, lol. I thought about calling a attorney, probably still will just thought I might try the internet first.

 

I'd take a local attorney's advice over a stranger's on the internet, but your choice . As far as the definition of a knife as tool or weapon, one's intent of use won't trump the laws definition. If the law says that a carried blade over 3 inches in length is a weapon, that's that.

Welcome to the forum

Everyone you meet knows something you don't.
- H. Jackson Brown

 

Sounds like you can carry your death ray though.

 

My buddy's father is a LEO and one day he caught my friend carrying a blade over 3.5 inches. He let him know that it is illegal and that an officer can confiscate it or worse if he was caught. I think length is the biggest issue, and you cannot conceal or open carry a blade larger than 3.5 inches. Yours is under 3 inches.

Note that while you are in the woods hunting, fishing, hiking, etc, you are allowed to carry knives larger than 3.5 inches.

Also note that having a CPL (MI CCW licence) does NOT exempt you from the knife laws . . . yeah. My buddy and I are a little salty about that.


Its seems I may have been wrong, and fallen for a common misconception in MI. Check this link out. http://www.michigan.gov/msp/0,1607,7-123-1586_27094-10953--,00.html

 

Dang, you're legal tests are...hard! :blink:

 

MSP - Michigan's Concealed Pistol Law - FAQs

So I decided to do a tad or research, it seems I may have been wrong.

Sounds like you can carry a blade over 3 inches. However, fixed blades are only allowed for hunting/outdoors purposes.

 

Sounds like you're actually carrying your knife inside your pocket. This may be a silly question, and in fact probably is, since you're a knife guy, but have you tried a folder of decent/good quality with a good, sturdy pocket clip? The Paramilitary 2 is excellent for this.

 

This would generally fall under the category MI has for "all other dangerous weapons", which typically includes improvised weapons as well. A blade being under 3" is generally considered legally safe, even when used against another person in defense.

If your blade, folding or fixed, is 3" or longer in length, and you state that it is for "self defense", yeah that'll get you in legal trouble. ALWAYS state that it is a tool, not a weapon or for defense, regardless of length.

You can carry a fixed blade of whatever length you want, however pay attention to the verbiage regarding hunting knives, carried and adapted as such.

Also be aware there is no preemption for knives in MI, so the next county over, city down the road, etc may enact knife laws much more strict, and much more different than State law such that suddenly your 2.5" tool becomes illegal to so much as possess outside of your home. Example: the city of Lansing bans any knife over 3 inches.

From SteveS on MGO: "FWIW, there is case laws that says that carrying a knife for self defense is a lawful purpose. See People v. Parker, 288 Mich App 500 (2010). The MSP have also indicated as such in Update #84:

Officers investigating complaints regarding a violation of MCL 750.226 involving a knife must include evidence that the knife’s blade length was over three inches in order to obtain successful prosecution of the complaint. The Court also noted MCL 750.226 does not prohibit the carrying of any weapon (including a knife with a blade over three inches in length) for purposes of self-defense."

SteveS: "It is not unlawful to carry a knife for self defense. Some knives are illegal if carried with unlawful intent. Others (double edged daggers) are unlawful per se. Therefore, a single edged knife, as long as it isn't carried with illegal intent, should be ok."

Steve is an attorney, so... there's that.

Your mileage may very... it's iffy in MI. Good luck.

 

In my beloved Bluegrass, your permit allows for legal carry of all SORTS of otherwise restricted "deadly" weapons including brass knuckles, switchblades, etc. You might check Michigan regs to see if a valid concealed weapon permit carries any similar knife exemptions. Good Luck!

 

It in fact does not.

We have a CPL, Concealed Pistol License (although it allows you to carry as many pistols as you want, not just one) but it does not include concealed carry of any other weapons, defined or not.

 

Not a lawyer so my advice counts for a hill of beans but, if you are intending to use that knife a a tool then there is probably no need for that secondary edge that would classify it as a dagger.

So you might want to round off the secondary edge so that it is no longer a sharpened edge.

Then (logic dictates) that it would cease to become a double edged knife.

But, as stated above....do your own research.
Knife laws are totally nonsensical in some states. It's really pathetic.

 

@QKShooter, where are you seeing a second cutting edge opposite the primary? If anything, it looks like it just has a tanto style tip.

But yes, if it has a cutting edge on both sides of the blade, regardless of it's intended or designed purpose, it is a dagger/stiletto style weapon according to MCL and illegal to so much as even POSSESS.

We really need knife rights reform in MI more so than anything regarding firearms.

 

Somebody mentioned a death ray is legal to carry and that's almost literally the case. Or was. You could literally carry a flame-thrower here, but not certain knives.

Pure Michigan.

The concealed carry laws are slightly tricky here and regarding knives, they can vary from one location to another within the state. The fact that each city can make its own laws regarding knives, superseding state laws, makes it almost impossible to legally carry a knife. I'm sure you are familiar with that.

I'm not a lawyer or cop. I, like you, am a CPL holder. I used to carry an Ontario Rat II, which is kind of just a decent beater knife, right at the state's maximum length. A crooked cop stole it from me after measuring it, claiming that knives have to be under, not at, the state maximum. This happened in a place with a knife law matching the state's law. What makes it worse is that I explained to the cop in question that I only carried the knife as a tool, not for defense, because the state's maximum is so low in the first place, that it would be a really bad day if you had to try to defend yourself with something so ridiculously small. So, luckily I didn't spend a lot on a knife, and hopefully you don't carry one that you are very attached to either.

I can also tell you that if you carry a firearm inside a vehicle, then it is considered concealed. So if you take this fixed blade in a motor vehicle with you, I imagine the same rule would apply. On the other hand, if you take it on a walk around the block and no part of it is covered, I would consider that open carry. But knives may no be under all the same rules as firearms.

 

That LEO who took your Rat II was incorrect. Both in his interpretation of the law and in his actions. Unless you were intending to do something illegal with that knife or were in the act of doing something illegal in general, or you were in a jurisdiction that had more strict knife regulation (which it sounds like you were not), he/she had no reason to confiscate the blade at all.

 

My Son bought me a Benchmade folder, not sure of the model, but it cost $265.00! For my birthday.
It has a stone washed blade finish, just over 3" long, and is as sharp as a razor!

It is very light weight. It is constructed of some kind of polymer.

It has a pocket clip, and lives in my right side pants pocket. I do not use this for rough cutting (IE Cardboard boxes) but use a sharp cheaper folder in this function, under 3" blade, half serated.
This is clipped to my right rear pocket, that is empty of anything. My left rear pocked has my wallet.

I was one of a group of firearm Instructors (Canadian) being lectured by an American Police Officer, on self defense.
I was not LEO. He asked who carried a folding knife, just about every one did.
Next question, who would use it to kill an assailant, if no firearm was available.

I was the only one! He asked me where my accent originated from, he was not surprised at the answer "Liverpool UK" It appeared he had traveled all over the UK in the US Military.

There was a definite bias against stabbing an other human, no matter what the circumstance.

Folding knives now, in England, for work, OK. Otherwise illegal. Knife attacks in the UK, huge!

 

OP, it's a Kermabit, thus a known design whose purpose is self defense. Get an leo that knows the history behind the K, you may be afoul of the law, no matter that you "say" it's not for sd.

 

Carrying and using a knife that is otherwise legal to possess, for the purposes of self-defense is not in and of itself illegal in Michigan. Intending to use a knife unlawfully against another (i.e. you are the attacker), however, is.

Excerpt:

"Officers investigating complaints regarding a
violation of MCL 750.226 involving a knife
must include evidence that the knife’s blade
length was over three inches in order to
obtain successful prosecution of the
complaint. The Court also noted MCL
750.226 does not prohibit the carrying of any
weapon (including a knife with a blade over
three inches in length) for purposes of selfdefense."

Original text:

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/msp/MSP_Legal_Update_No._84_326940_7.pdf

 

JonathanG

Why X out the maple leaf?